Time: Thu Jun 26 12:17:34 1997
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	Thu, 26 Jun 1997 12:14:54 -0700 (MST)
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Date: Thu, 26 Jun 1997 12:12:22 -0700
To: fwolist@sportsmen.net
From: Paul Andrew Mitchell [address in tool bar]
Subject: SLS: being a witness against yourself

Objection.  Taking the Fifth Amendment
does not thereby declare oneself to be a 
criminal.  Sorry, but I must respectfully
disagree with your conclusion here.

The Right not to be a witness against
yourself is fundamental, and therefore
unalienable.  

Only you can waive that Right.  
Nobody else can.  

We cannot punish people for exercising
their Rights.

Haven't we learned anything during the
past 7 years of intensive research
into American Law, never repealed?

The Fifth Amendment embraces adminstrative
hearings, as well as civil actions.

/s/ Paul Mitchell
http://www.supremelaw.com


At 11:28 AM 6/26/97 -0700, you wrote:
>================[ Distributed Message ]================
>         ListServer: fwolist (Free World Order)
>               Type: Not Moderated
>     Distributed on: 26-JUN-97, 11:28:30
>Original Written by: IN:behold@teleport.com.
>=======================================================
>
>
>At 06:55 AM 6/26/97 -0700, fwolist@sportsmen.net wrote:
>>================[ Distributed Message ]================
>>         ListServer: fwolist (Free World Order)
>>               Type: Not Moderated
>>     Distributed on: 26-JUN-97, 06:55:06
>>Original Written by: IN:pmitch@primenet.com.
>>=======================================================
>>
>>
>>Objection.  Your invocation of the
>>Fifth Amendment cannot be used against
>>you, under judicial rules of procedure.
>>Thus, no one can infer guilt from 
>>a Fifth Amendment defense, not the judge,
>>and not the jury. 
>
>Randy Lee Geiszler:
>
>Meanwhile, if on claims the right not to answer a question in a civil
>proceeding or in a proceeding wherein he is not named defendant, on basis
>that the answer might incriminate him, he proclaims himself a criminal in
>order to claim exemption from answering.


Objection!!!  Make that, OBJECTION!!!!!


 Therefore, without necessarily
>admitting what crime was comitted, he claims to have comitted some criminal
>contuct, providing justification to investigatory bodies to begin criminal
>investigations that might not otherwise be justified.  Nothing like
>pointing the finger at yourself saying "He's a criminal" with the personal
>knowledge to make your assertion believable, and under oath no less if your
>already in the witness stand.
>
> Now, I know you WANT
>>to infer guilt, as a private non-party, and
>>you are free to do so, but don't bring
>>that inference into a court of law,
>>because it violates a fundamental Right.
>>Deprivations of fundamental Rights are 
>>felony violations of 18 U.S.C. 242.
>
>Randy Lee Geiszler:
>
>If your a Fourteenth Amendment "citizen."  The original enactment codified
>in 18 U.S.C. 242, was a civil rights act enacted under auspicious of a
>Civil War Amendment.  Check it out.  A Citizen by name of Rod Strand
>pointed this out to me over 10 years ago and when I researched it I found
>out he was absolutely right.  In fact, title 18 U.S.C. sections 241-245 are
>all derived from the Civil War Amendments through civil rights acts enacted
>under their supposed authority.
>
>>Check it out!  So, we can all laugh about
>>Mark Fuhrman, but we cannot use the state
>>to punish him if and when he chooses to
>>take the Fifth.
>
>Randy Lee Geiszler:
>
>Meanwhile, investigatory bodys can use his declaration that he is a
>criminal as justification  to investigate him to find independant evidence
>of his crime.  Claiming the right not to incriminate yourself, then, may
>prevent answering a question, but may simultaneously open a can of worms
>you would rather keep a lid on.  In addition, when the party is a
>defendant, he is automatically immune to process or order requiring him to
>testify because the government has already alleged criminal conduct against
>him.  In such an instance the "defendant" or accused does not have to admit
>being a criminal to refuse to testify, because the government has supplied
>an accusation in place of the admission.  The real purpose of the Fifth
>Amendment limitation being to prevent the governments from beating
>confessions out of the accused, either physically or by way of process and
>sanctions.
>>
>>/s/ Paul Mitchell
>>http://www.supremelaw.com
>>
>>
>>
>>At 09:39 PM 6/25/97 -0700, you wrote:
>>>================[ Distributed Message ]================
>>>         ListServer: fwolist (Free World Order)
>>>               Type: Not Moderated
>>>     Distributed on: 25-JUN-97, 21:39:42
>>>Original Written by: IN:patwriot@juno.com.
>>>=======================================================
>>>
>>>
>>>You should know there is nothing in the Constitution
>>>about sefl incrimination.   Any person who says his
>>>answer to a question might tend to incriminte him is
>>>incriminating himself with those words.
>
>Randy Lee Geiszler:
>
>Correct, the Fifth Amendment says specifically: "No person shall... be
>compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..."  By this
>language their must first be a "criminal case", second if the accused is
>made defendant in the criminal case and is called to testify by the
>prosecution, (who, by presumption of law, is calling witnesses against the
>defendant to prove his guilt) the defendant cannot be compelled to testify
>and his refusal to do so does not constitute an admission of criminal wrong
>doing.  Contra, in instances where their is no criminal prosecution or the
>party called to testify is not the defendant in a criminal case. 
>>>
>>>Who wants to argue?
>>>
>>>Pat
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>How long could the New World Odor last if all Libertarians, all Birchers
>>>OR
>>>all members of the NRA could show why the New World Odor needs babies
>>>and retirees dead?  Their spokesman, Robert McNamara said: "There are
>>>many ways to make the death rate increase"   Americans must be disarmed
>>>before too many learn why any sure cure for cancer must be suppressed.
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>======================================================================== 
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>========================================================================
>>Paul Andrew Mitchell                 : Counselor at Law, federal witness
>>B.A., Political Science, UCLA;  M.S., Public Administration, U.C. Irvine
>>
>>tel:     (520) 320-1514: machine; fax: (520) 320-1256: 24-hour/day-night
>>email:   [address in tool bar]       : using Eudora Pro 3.0.2 on 586 CPU
>>website: http://www.supremelaw.com   : visit the Supreme Law Library now
>>ship to: c/o 2509 N. Campbell, #1776 : this is free speech,  at its best
>>             Tucson, Arizona state   : state zone,  not the federal zone
>>             Postal Zone 85719/tdc   : USPS delays first class  w/o this
>>
>>As agents of the Most High, we came here to establish justice.  We shall
>>not leave, until our mission is accomplished and justice reigns eternal.
>>========================================================================
>>[This text formatted on-screen in Courier 11, non-proportional spacing.]
>>
>>
>>========================================================================
>>To subscribe: send a message to the fwolist@sportsmen.net
>>with the word SUBSCRIBE in the subject/topic field.  Use UNSUBSCRIBE to
>>remove yourself from the list. Questions/comments/problems?
>>    email: Not Moderated@sportsmen.net or listmgmt@sportsmen.net
>>For info about this system and its lists email: info@sportsmen.net
>>
>>======================================================================== 
>>via: Sportsman's Paradise~~Online 602-922-1639 - www.sportsmen.net
>>
>>
>>
>
>                                                Randy Lee Geiszler
>                                                BEHOLD! Newsletter
>                                                Fourth Judicial District
>                                                522 Hartke Loop
>                                                Oregon City, Oregon
>                                                (503) 657-6207
>
>"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better
>than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace.  We ask
>not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you.
>May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were
>our countrymen." - Samuel Adams."
>
>****************************************************************************
>Copy Rights secured to Robert W. Wangrud & Randy Geiszler.  
>All Rights reserved. behold@teleport.com
>PLEASE NOTE THE NEW SITE - Home Page BEHOLD NEWSLETTER: 
>http://www.announce.com/behold/index.htm
>****************************************************************************
>
>
>
>
>========================================================================
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>with the word SUBSCRIBE in the subject/topic field.  Use UNSUBSCRIBE to
>remove yourself from the list. Questions/comments/problems?
>    email: Not Moderated@sportsmen.net or listmgmt@sportsmen.net
>For info about this system and its lists email: info@sportsmen.net
>
>======================================================================== 
>via: Sportsman's Paradise~~Online 602-922-1639 - www.sportsmen.net
>
>
>
>

========================================================================
Paul Andrew Mitchell                 : Counselor at Law, federal witness
B.A., Political Science, UCLA;  M.S., Public Administration, U.C. Irvine

tel:     (520) 320-1514: machine; fax: (520) 320-1256: 24-hour/day-night
email:   [address in tool bar]       : using Eudora Pro 3.0.2 on 586 CPU
website: http://www.supremelaw.com   : visit the Supreme Law Library now
ship to: c/o 2509 N. Campbell, #1776 : this is free speech,  at its best
             Tucson, Arizona state   : state zone,  not the federal zone
             Postal Zone 85719/tdc   : USPS delays first class  w/o this

As agents of the Most High, we came here to establish justice.  We shall
not leave, until our mission is accomplished and justice reigns eternal.
========================================================================
[This text formatted on-screen in Courier 11, non-proportional spacing.]

      


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