Time: Thu Sep 11 07:27:31 1997 by primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA19199; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:27:25 -0700 (MST) by usr05.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA22117; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:23:55 -0700 (MST) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 07:23:48 -0700 To: (Recipient list suppressed) From: Paul Andrew Mitchell [address in tool bar] Subject: SLS: Concealed Weapons - Vermont Style <snip> > >>Forwarded by The Word Warriorette - >> >>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- >> >>Forwarded by The Word Warriorette - Some people who are pro-life believe that >>the 2nd amendment issue is far removed from them. Read the "Note**" directly >>below, then please read the entire article. Joel 3:10 "Beat your plowshares >>into swords And your pruning hooks into spears; Let the weak say, 'I am >>strong.'"" DK >> >>**Note the following in the article below: "c. Revoke for politically >>incorrect speech -- In Oregon, officials have been known to revoke concealed >>carry licenses because of one's political views. In one case, a permit holder >>had his license revoked because he was the editor of a pro-life newspaper. >>(5) (Footnote: 5. In a court hearing to have the license returned, the judge >>in the case admitted that the individual did not meet the criteria for a >>revocation (i.e., he had never engaged in acts of violence or made threats of >>violence) but agreed to uphold the revocation anyway. The justification the >>judge gave was that the abortion issue was "a volatile one" and people >>involved in it should not be allowed to carry guns. A friend of the >>"defendant" made a routine inquiry to the sheriff's department to see if any >>abortion doctors or activists had their licenses revoked. By Oregon law this >>is public information. He was immediately visited by four FBI agents who >>demanded to know the reason for the request. >>Statement by Kevin Starrett, Oregon Representative for Gun Owners of >>America, August 21, 1995.) >> >>>From an Internet source.Begin Forwarded Message: >> >> >><< Why Adopt a Vermont-style CCW Law? >> >> >> Several states are considering adopting "Vermont-style" concealed >> carry legislation. Most of the Carry Concealed Weapon (CCW) laws in >> the country require citizens to first get permits. But in a couple of >> states, like Vermont, citizens can carry a firearm without getting >> permission . . . without paying a fee . . . or without going through >> any kind of government- imposed waiting period. There are many >> benefits to adopting a genuine right to carry law: >> >> 1. Carrying a firearm is a "right" not a "privilege" >> >> The Second Amendment guarantees that "the right of the people to keep >> and bear arms shall not be infringed." This means that law-abiding >> citizens should not need to beg the government for permission to carry >> a firearm. That would turn the "right" to bear arms into a mere >> "privilege." Likewise, one should not have to be photographed, >> fingerprinted, or registered before they can exercise their Second >> Amendment rights. Criminals certainly do not jump through these >> "hoops." The Second Amendment is no different than any of the other >> protections enumerated in the Bill of Rights. That is, honest citizens >> should not need a government issued permission slip; rather, they >> should be able to carry as a matter of right. >> >> 2. The issuing of permits can be abused by officials >> >> a. Refuse to issue >> >> * New York City: Officials in New York City routinely deny >> gun permits for ordinary citizens and store owners because >> -- as the courts have ruled -- they have no greater need for >> protection than anyone else in the city. In fact, the >> authorities have even refused to issue permits when the >> courts have ordered them to do so. (1) >> >> * Gary, Indiana: Then-Mayor Richard Hatcher let it be known >> in 1979 that he would not be approving any citizens' >> concealed carry applications. He then said if they wanted to >> challenge his authority, they were welcome to take him to >> court. It took citizens over 10 years (and thousands of >> dollars in legal fees) to get any relief. (2) >> >> * San Jose, CA: Joseph McNamara, a former police chief and >> anti-gun spokesman, bragged in his 1984 book, Safe & Sane, >> that "in San Jose, I have made it considerably tougher for >> residents to get handgun permits." (3) >> >> b. Require fingerprints -- Virginia applicants for concealed >> carry permits were forced to submit to FBI fingerprint background >> checks without any authorization requiring such checks. (4) >> >> c. Revoke for politically incorrect speech -- In Oregon, >> officials have been known to revoke concealed carry licenses >> because of one's political views. In one case, a permit holder >> had his license revoked because he was the editor of a pro-life >> newspaper. (5) >> >> d. Print licensee holders' names in newspapers -- In several >> states, newspapers have frequently printed the names of concealed >> carry permit holders, which are almost always public information. >> (6) >> >> 3. Officials can "raise the hurdles" in order to get a permit >> >> * The power to license a right is the power to destroy a right >> >> a. Arbitrary Delays -- While New Jersey law requires applications >> to be responded to within thirty days, delays of ninety days are >> routine; sometimes, applications are delayed for several years >> for no readily apparent reason. (7) >> >> b. Arbitrary Denials -- See the examples above from New York >> City, Indiana and California. >> >> c. Arbitrary Fee Increases -- In 1994, the Clinton administration >> pushed for a license fee increase of almost 1,000 percent on gun >> dealers. According to U.S. News & World Report, the >> administration was seeking the license fee increase "in hopes of >> driving many of America's 258,000 licensed gun dealers out of >> business." (8) This example clearly shows how easily government >> officials can abuse the issuing of carry permits. Instead of >> using lower fees to merely pay for the processing of permits, >> officials can raise the fees to keep people from exercising their >> rights. >> >> 4. Vermont has a genuine right to carry law (i.e., requires no >> permits) and yet boasts the lowest crime rate in the nation (9) >> >> a. Nationwide, concealed carry laws have worked to drop crime >> rates. Indeed, a comprehensive national study in 1996 determined >> that violent crime fell after states made it legal to carry >> concealed firearms. (10) >> >> b. The results of the study showed: >> >> * States which passed concealed carry laws reduced their >> murder rate by 8.5%, rapes by 5%, aggravated assaults by 7% >> and robbery by 3%; and >> >> * If those states not having concealed carry laws had >> adopted such laws in 1992, then approximately 1,570 murders, >> 4,177 rapes, 60,000 aggravated assaults and 12,000 robberies >> would have been avoided yearly. (11) >> >> 5. Waiting periods of any kind threaten honest people's safety. (12) >> >> Note: Criminals usually don't bother to go through the waiting >> period since they don't apply for permits. >> >> a. New York. In 1983, Igor Hutorsky was murdered by two burglars >> who broke into his Brooklyn furniture store. The tragedy is that >> some time before the murder his business partner had applied for >> permission to keep a handgun at the store. Even four months after >> the murder, the former partner had still not heard from the >> police about the status of his gun permit. (13) >> >> b. Colorado. Talk show host (Alan Berg) was gunned down in 1984 >> after being denied a concealed carry permit. (14) >> >> c. Wisconsin. In 1991, Bonnie Elmasri inquired about getting a >> gun to protect herself from a husband who had repeatedly >> threatened to kill her. She was told there was a 48 hour waiting >> period to buy a handgun. But unfortunately, Bonnie was never able >> to pick up a gun. She and her two sons were killed the next day >> by an abusive husband of whom the police were well aware. (15) >> >> d. Los Angeles. USA Today reported that many of the people >> rushing to gun stores during the 1992 riots were "lifelong >> gun-control advocates, running to buy an item they thought they'd >> never need." Ironically, they were outraged to discover they had >> to wait 15 days to buy a gun for self-defense. (16) >> >> e. Virginia. In 1993, Marine Cpl. Rayna Ross bought a gun (in a >> non-waiting period state) and used it two days later to kill an >> attacker who was armed with a bayonet. (17) Had a 5-day waiting >> period been in effect, Ms. Ross would have been defenseless >> against the man who was stalking her. >> >> 6. CCW licenses register gun owners -- and licensing can lead to >> confiscation of firearms >> >> a. Step One: Registration -- In the mid-1960s officials in New >> York City began registering long guns. They promised they would >> never use such lists to take away firearms from honest citizens. >> But in 1991, the city banned (and soon began confiscating) many >> of those very guns. (18) >> >> b. Step Two: Confiscation -- In 1992, a New York city paper >> reported that, "Police raided the home of a Staten Island man who >> refused to comply with the city's tough ban on assault weapons, >> and seized an arsenal of firearms. . . . Spot checks are planned >> [for other homes]." (19) >> >> c. Foreign Countries -- Gun registration has led to confiscation >> in several countries, including Greece, Ireland, Jamaica and >> Bermuda. (20) And in an exhaustive study on this subject, Jews >> for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership has researched and >> translated several gun control laws from foreign countries. Their >> publication, Lethal Laws: "Gun Control" is the Key to Genocide, >> documents how gun control (and confiscation) has preceded the >> slaughter and genocide of millions of people in Turkey, the >> Soviet Union, Germany, China, Cambodia and others. (21) >> >> 7 . Officials cannot license or register a constitutional right >> >> The Supreme Court held in Lamont v. Postmaster General (1965) >> that the First Amendment prevents the government from registering >> purchasers of magazines and newspapers -- even if such material >> is "communist political propaganda." (22) >> >> 8. Citizens, even when untrained, show amazing accuracy and >> self-restraint with firearms >> >> Citizens shoot and kill at least twice as many criminals as >> police do every year (1,527 to 606). (23) And readers of Newsweek >> learned in 1993 that "only 2 percent of civilian shootings >> involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. >> The 'error rate' for the police, however, was 11 percent, more >> than five times as high." (24) >> >> --------------------------------------- >> 1. David Kopel, "Trust the People: The Case Against Gun Control," >> [Cato Institute] Policy Analysis 109 (July 11, 1988): 25-26. 2. >> Supreme Court of Indiana, Kellogg v. City of Gary, 1990. 3. Joseph >> McNamara, Safe & Sane, (1984): 74. 4. Peter Finn, "FBI Stops Checking >> Va. Gun Applicants," The Washington Post, 12 July 1996. 5. In a court >> hearing to have the license returned, the judge in the case admitted >> that the individual did not meet the criteria for a revocation (i.e., >> he had never engaged in acts of violence or made threats of violence) >> but agreed to uphold the revocation anyway. The justification the >> judge gave was that the abortion issue was "a volatile one" and people >> involved in it should not be allowed to carry guns. A friend of the >> "defendant" made a routine inquiry to the sheriff's department to see >> if any abortion doctors or activists had their licenses revoked. By >> Oregon law this is public information. He was immediately visited by >> four FBI agents who demanded to know the reason for the request. >> Statement by Kevin Starrett, Oregon Representative for Gun Owners of >> America, August 21, 1995. 6. North Carolina, Pennsylvania and Virginia >> are just three examples where local newspapers have printed the names >> of concealed carry permit holders. 7. Kopel, "Trust the People," at >> 26. 8. U.S. News & World Report, (17 January 1994): 8. 9. Morgan >> Quitno Press, Crime State Rankings 1996, at iv. 10. John R. Lott, Jr. >> and David B. Mustard, "Crime, Deterrence, and Right-to-Carry Concealed >> Handguns," University of Chicago, (13 July 1996). See also Lott, Jr., >> "More Guns, Less Violent Crime," The Wall Street Journal (28 August >> 1996). 11. See supra note 9. 12. Any waiting period -- whether the >> wait to buy a gun, or the wait to get a carry permit -- can have >> disastrous consequences. While most of the examples listed here relate >> to gun purchase waiting periods, the principle is the same. Waiting >> periods put one's rights on hold; and when one is in immediate danger, >> the result can be death. 13. Senate, "Handgun Violence," at 107, >> citing Novae Russkae Slovo, Vol. LXXII, No. 26.291, (6 Nov. 1983). 14. >> Stephen Singular, Talked to Death: The Murder of Alan Berg and the >> Rise of the Neo-Nazis, (1987): 137-138. Since he was shot from behind, >> one could possibly argue that a gun might not have helped him. Of >> course, had Berg received a carry permit, one can never be sure if his >> being armed would have served as a deterrent to the killer, who had >> stalked him for some time. Regardless, the point is that he should >> have been able to defend himself. 15. Congressional Record, 8 May >> 1991, pp. H 2859, H 2862. 16. Jonathan T. Lovitt, "Survival for the >> armed," USA Today, 4 May 1992. 17. Wall Street Journal, 3 March 1994 >> at A10. 18. On August 16, 1991, New York City Mayor David Dinkins >> signed Local Law 78 which banned the possession and sale of certain >> rifles and shotguns. 19. John Marzulli, "Weapons ban defied: S.I. man, >> arsenal seized," Daily News, 5 September 1992. 20. David Kopel, "Trust >> the People: The Case Against Gun Control," [Cato Institute] Policy >> Analysis 109 (July 11, 1988):25. 21. Jay Simkin, Aaron Zelman and Alan >> M. Rice, Lethal Laws: "Gun Control" is the Key to Genocide, >> (Milwaukee: Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership, 1994). >> 22. Lamont v. Postmaster General, 381 U.S. 301, 85 S. Ct. 1493, 14 L. >> Ed. 2d 398 (1965). 23. Kleck, Point Blank: Guns and Violence in >> America, (1991):111-116, 148. 24. George F. Will, "Are We 'a Nation of >> Cowards'?," Newsweek (15 November 1993):93. >> >> **************************************************************** >> Chris W. Stark >> Gun Owners of America - Texas Representative >> e-mail: gunowner@onramp.net >> >> Visit our Web Page at: http://rampages.onramp.net/~gunowner >> >> **************************************************************** >> "No class or group or party in Germany could escape its share >> of responsibility for the abandonment of the democratic Republic >> and the advent of Adolf Hitler. The cardinal error of the Germans >> who opposed Nazism was their failure to unite against it. >> ....the 63% of the German people who expressed their opposition >> to Hitler were much too divided and shortsighted to combine against >> a common danger which they must have known would overwhelm them >> unless they united, HOWEVER TEMPORARY, to stamp it out." >> >> -William L. Shirer, author of "The rise and fall of the Third Reich" >> p.259 >> .....they who do not learn from History are DOOMED to repeat it!! >> >> >> >> >> >> >Please visit http://www.prospectorsbanqueclub.com > and http://www.eagleflt.com > > To receive posts from this list send an E-MAIL to me with the word >"subscribe" in the subject box. > ================================================================== > EAGLEFLIGHT > ///, //// > \ /, / >. David E. Rydel > \ /, _/ /. ***** > \_ /_/ /. United States Theatre Command > \__/_ < Voice-248-391-0798 > /<<< \_\_ Fax-248-391-6785 > /,)^>>_._ \ Alt.Fax-248-391-3528 > (/ \\ /\\\ E-MAIL: EAGLEFLT@thumb.net > // ```` > ==============((`============================================= A VOICE OF THE MILITIAS IN NORTH AMERICA AMERICA > ======================================================================== Paul Andrew Mitchell : Counselor at Law, federal witness B.A., Political Science, UCLA; M.S., Public Administration, U.C. Irvine tel: (520) 320-1514: machine; fax: (520) 320-1256: 24-hour/day-night email: [address in tool bar] : using Eudora Pro 3.0.3 on 586 CPU website: http://www.supremelaw.com : visit the Supreme Law Library now ship to: c/o 2509 N. Campbell, #1776 : this is free speech, at its best Tucson, Arizona state : state zone, not the federal zone Postal Zone 85719/tdc : USPS delays first class w/o this As agents of the Most High, we came here to establish justice. We shall not leave, until our mission is accomplished and justice reigns eternal. ======================================================================== [This text formatted on-screen in Courier 11, non-proportional spacing.]
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