Posted by Two Cities on August 27, 1997 at 19:41:15:
In Reply to: Re: Deeds REPONSE-Any experiences with Allodials? posted by Ann on August 27, 1997 at 14:16:46:
: : :
: : : Hope nobody minds my deleting the original question for expediency:
: : : 1) If you provide your e-mail address, I'll e-mail
: : : you directly with the name of a fella out west
: : : that deals with this type of info..he's super
: : : busy but knows about all the de factor vs de jure
: : : instruments dealing with "property."I hesitate
: : : to put his phone number/address out on inet w/o
: : : his permission, etc.
: : : Also: Surely some of these groups that deal
: : : with allodials/land patents and such would probably
: : : know. Search on these topics and some of these
: : : groups are bound to come up.
: : : Ann
: : The search was informative. Thanks.
: : Municipalities are perhaps raising the land patent
: : issues at time of incorporation, and at all times
: : subsequent in the event of annexations, thereby
: : establishing their PARAMOUNT interest in the land
: : under their "jurisdiction".Any additional pointers
: : are always welcome. A YES vote in an annexation
: : election, is perhaps akin to a feudal oath of fealty.
: : Does anyone know.
: : Property transfers that do not transfer the interest in
: : the land patent, such as warranty deeds, deeds of trust or
: : other instruments may only transfer the illusion of
: : color of title, keeping the patent holder as the
: : true owner, and entitled to his fief.
: Good info on deeds..agrees with concepts of what I have also read on this topic.
: The real question is: Does anybody have first-hand experience with actuallly filing
: a land patent/allodial deed on their property and having it be "effective" with
: the local taxing authorities? I've not heard of suceess story in Texas, although heard
: (stories) in another state who supposedly got a "you're exempt" letter back from them...
: wish I had kept details but cannot confirm.
: My supposition is that it (may) help/at least delay with the "land grab", by "biospheres"
: and "Heritage Rivers", etc. (per a land patent researcher I know)etc.
: FYI: Just talked with a fella the other day (here in Texas) whose land had NOT been "rendered"
: but they found him anyway and put a lien on his property for not paying property taxes. He's
: trying to work on obtaining allodial deed, etc. Any success stories..please tell us.
: Obviously, my personal belief is that property taxes are the worse of all taxes, since
: regardless of what "net profit" or "income" you have, or you citizenship status, so
: those property taxes keep going up and up,and have nothing whatsoever to do with your
: "cash flow." HOPE TO GET SOME MORE POSTS ON THIS TOPIC.
: WHat's youre experiences..let us know...I'll share my experience
: when I have them..good or bad.
Try these for info. They're a little old, but
include cites from as recent as 1985
I'm just conjecturing as to the actual obfuscation
that goes on. The county registrar's office has
received a NEW (and improved) system of recording
deeds etc. Involves computer imaging. On my first
cut through the micro-fishe reels I managed to get
back to 1960. Then the process get's harder....
I am assuming that "the powers that be" have done
everything legal, so I am assuming that they have
raised the original land patents in their own name.
This in order to cement the legal and lawful connection
to the property tax (land rent) that they charge. In
terms with municipalities involved in annexations,
conducted under personal identifiable ballot, by the
property owners of the affected area, some process
must be involved after the annexation is completed,
in order to transfer the taxing authority from the
previous beneficiary to the new beneficiary. Perhaps
this is done by the municipality raising the land patent
in it's name, transferring it from the county. Perhaps
everything is done de facto, i.e. the filing of a property
tax return is admission that the government owns
the property. A neighbor had a fence line dispute.
Recalling a conversation from long ago, my neighbor
was made aware of an original land grant by the city
attorney (all this in an age prior to awareness).
Everything else seems to be out in the open, ready for
inspection and interpretation. Best place to hide
grass (definitely vetch or clover) is in your lawn.
How many property records searches are done with the
municipality as the subject matter? I'll work on that
Of course in the normal course of modern real estate
transactions, the actual contract is never consummated
for lack of consideration (no MONEY transferred), so the
deed is worthless, and subject to challenge due to the
failure of the contract. Payment of money (in hand paid)
has to accompany and be witnessed to cement the transaction.
So without payment, the previous patent holder sits secure
through the invalidity of contract.
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