Posted by Two Cities on April 04, 1998 at 15:33:36:
In Reply to: Re: Bad Karma Paul Mitchell? posted by Common Right Group on April 04, 1998 at 05:24:07:
: : My meager wooden nickel on other issues of jurisdiction.
: : county vs. County vs. COUNTY
: : Actual borders are assigned to counties. There descriptors are township, range, section, east, west, north and south to mention a few. The legal descriptions make sure that they read like places on the earth.
: : Counties (I'm guessing, haven't seen one) give Legal descriptions with Township, Range, Section etc. and it is doubtful whether these descriptions actually reference places, but rather points of beginning. Points are of course mathematical abstractions with no extension in physical space.
: : COUNTIES give LEGAL DESCRIPTIONS WITH TWP, RGE, SEC, POB ETC. and are the locus for the collection of PERSONAL PROPERTY TAXES NEVER SPECIFIED WITH A UNIT OF ACCOUNT. THE PRESENTMENT IS ENTIRELY MADE UP OF NUMBERS and the word dollar is absent. Does a legal definition exist for the sign "S"?
: : COUNTIES ARE ENTIRELY ROMAN, AND DO NOT APPEAR TO HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE OF LOWER CASE LETTERS, ALTHOUGH THEY DO RECOGNIZE THE ARABIC NUMBERS.
: : I'm beginning to think that the county treasurer which oversees a lawful realm of property taxation contracts with the County Treasurer for the collections concerning artificial entities, and the County Treasurer with knowledge of who the Legal Owner is in the County, further contracts with the COUNTY TREASURER for collections of PRESENTMENTS delivered to TENANTS IN FIEF, RETURNING IMAGINARY COMMERCIAL CREDIT WITH 'PAYMENT'.
: : The legal hooks arise via the common mechanism of property transfers utilizing Real (REAL) Estate (ESTATE) Agents and Title Companies and Mortgage lenders and brokers. Their general system will ensure that the man/woman is artfully translated into either one or two separate fictions along the way. The process seems to exist to avoid this trap, and it is in plain sight within at least the RCW. The obfuscation is quite old, at least 95 years judging by an old deed (the county transcription).
: : A correctly executed property transfer of land conveying a place on the earth requires attention to miniscule detail, and the shedding of several decades (if not centuries) of language destruction. Every single word is a potential land mine.
: : The degree of legal fiction that attaches to an individual seems to be closely related to being able to attach an address to the individual's name, thereby rooting the individual to a fixed or permanent location. These entities are address fixated when compelled to communicate.
: : The COUNTY will only COMMUNICATE with BACKWARDS SPELLED AND COMMATIZED YOU. Any other required communication the COUNTY kicks back up to the next level, the County which communicates with your correct name but insists on the existence of an non c/o address. My guess is they would have to kick it back up another level, to county, to be able to communicate directly with the individual. That is of course undesirable from their viewpoint since such an imposition would rapidly crumble status quo.
: : These separate corporate personas that get attached to most people through the course of daily living do not appear to be inextricably melded, ie. with awareness of the separate nature Two Cities is easily distinguishable from Cities, Two and CITIES, TWO etc. If other individuals serving in corporate capacities on directorships of corporations in this land can differentiate their hats, so can we. Sometimes it might just be convenient to purchase CITY WATER and for the purposes of that billing statement become a person as long as the liability is limited.
: Nice theory. What does it mean? First of all, What is an individual? An individual what?
: The word "Individual" is an adjective, so that makes all general uses of the term too vague to be valid for use in law.
: We bring this up because we weren't sure that the word itself was not defined somewhere in California's statutes. It's not, except, like in the federal, to list a bunch of junk it "may include." So we ran this little test past a local bureaucrat, and got about the same reaction one would expect from a cat being chased by a large dog. The actions and expressions varied from total arrogance to bewilderment and befudlement to finally calling the marshalls to have me escorted out of the building.
: Well, it's a word they use, so they ought to be able to tell me what it alludes to.
: You're the one that brought up the subject of land mines. Sort of embarassing to step on one you planted?
: All in good fun, but true nonetheless.
Thanks. Sorry about the land mine. I however recently had quite a 'nice' conversation with a 'License Coordinator'. I was attempting to transfer a VEHICLE CERTIFICATE OF TITLE, and after not having gotten anywhere with the clerk usually parked at the desk, I asked to speak to her boss. Not that I got anywhere in particular with this "License Coordinator" except to have her admit that it was beyond her scope of authority to deal with my request, and she wished me good luck. No marshalls were called. I just happen to think that I showed up unprepared at the wrong window, not quite being in full command of the administrative process, surrounding the Motor Vehicle Code etc..
As far as the word individual, I would avoid it in a contract and substitute man/woman perhaps husband and wife, perhaps married.
Since the law, at least in Washington, and particularily those sections that have historical footnotes that predates 1889, reads pretty well, I happen to think that it is all out there in "looking glass land". On this one I just ran out of time, but I took a bill of sale, that was payed with a United States Postal Money Order, perhaps not quite in the realm of lawful money, and decided to not use the form presented for the title transfer. The previous TITLE just said that you had 15 days to make an application for transfer of ownership to the County Auditor or a representative. It also said on the back of the TITLE (not spelling it all out) that the VERBOSE on the back of that document MAY be used.
So I decided to use something else and ran out of time. When a man touches a VEHICLE through purchase it only makes sense that the true owner also be notified within some reasonable time. Particularily if the PERSON you 'bought it from' is only a TENANT on the property. So I thought it would be prudent to make an application and file it with the Auditor. Took me a while to figure that one out, and I ended up going to one of these satelite license convenience places, avoided the notary charge by having had *my* application notarized elsewhere and filed this along with the form the drone insisted on. She tore one up and refused to file the first one after I started making corrections in the computer generated text.
And I was at wrong place anyhow, a satelite drone (making some living in the world). So I signed that one TDC since the 15 days were up, and I don't have any particular desire discussing the failure to follow administrative procedur publisized in plain sight with some trooper, or worse yet some judge that would probably be correct. But the satelite drone had a severe reaction to the unusual. So next time around, I'll try to be a little more prepared, and if time permits, starting with the Motor Vehicle Code from the date of it's first implemetation. I'm hoping and guessing that the original Code provided a methodology for the registration of private carriages alongside that proper subject of government regulation, commercial vehicles with a potential to cause harm to the public that the government protects.
Now wasn't that a cute one. Next time I'll try to insist to file it with the County Auditor.
Of course in order to do that, you have to be able to reach him, i.e. you (the man) have to show up at the place of his office, and if you end up at the COUNTY AUDITOR no business will be transacted. Then I don't particularily think that these entities have any great desire or duty to engage men or persons in communication unless there exists a bona fide need to conduct business. Property transfers is a business to be reacted to by their own laws, solicitiations for random information may not fall within the scope of their duties or authorities, so it might be pointless to even try without the 'wedge' of some statutory item that requires their attention. So you want a filing receipt from the event. My best bet would be to mail it registered and notorized along with the filing fee to the correct Mailing address, along with a surplussage of 'payment' for the fee. This will force a refund. I tried to contribute to the State Archivists coffee fund but that didn't work.
Fifteen days is a pretty generous amount of time, if the skids are greased, and attempting to file with the County Auditor (in the flesh) is worth a try, but certainly imo not worth bitching about to the point of having armed guards called to break up a disturbance. Some attorney generals opinions on the subject of the County Auditors duty, and the entire statute on this subject matter might be worthwhile to carry along. Better to be shown out politely.
So correspondence from the COUNTY AUDITOR shows up with a postmark EVERETT WA and correspondence with the County Auditor is deposited in the mail at EVERETT WASH. and the lingo subversion is "brillig in the smithey toves" and does "jumble and gyre in the wabes". There is an initiative on the run up here to try to abolish the excise tax portion from the VEHICLE TAG BILL, and all the power to it. How many men and women in their private capacities would jump on the bandwagon of filing a VEHICLE transfer of ownership if they could be shown how? How many would jump off of "REAL ESTATE WITH IMPROVEMENTS" onto land with appurtenances if the road was clear? Logjam in the making by scribes for at least a century.
So your point is well taken. The fiction does perhaps not attach to the individual, but rather to the man/woman and it is the process of them acting in their own capacity that is subverted. I already catch myself at a studder sometimes and this won't make it any better. At least kids can be quick on the uptake if they listen.
And the public school (groan, I'm not pure enough to home school or rich enough to purchase an education at prevailing rates) mark kids down for not knowing how to 'correctly' address an envelope, two letter abbreviation included. These teachers perhaps need to read the DMM or be shown a postmark.
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